October 2017 Advocacy Minutes

 

Advocacy Meeting

October 23, 2017 6:00 - 8:30 p.m.

Alpine County Library

Ben Stone - Advocacy Committee Chairperson/Vice-President SDMBA

 

Meeting called to order:  

  • Welcome and Introductions (Susie Murphy - Executive Director)

Bob Heiar (Descanso Supervising Ranger), Lindsey Steinwachs (Recreation Officer-Descanso), Kevin Loomis (SDMBA President), Ben Stone (VP /Advocacy Committee Chair), Jose Galaz (Board Member), Jeff Tanzola (Board Member), Don Sutton (Board Member)

 

  • Questions or comments?

 

  1. Anderson Truck Trail/Road decommissioning and trails - Cleveland National Forest, Descanso District

Preliminary questions fielded:  

Why couldn’t we just leave ATT alone?

Anderson Truck Trail has been set to be decommissioned since 2008, only recently did the Forest Service receive funding for this process. There was no option to leave it alone, the only option until earlier this year was to close the roads altogether. SDMBA was able to convince them to change the order to leave a trail in its place where the road bed is currently located.

 

Why is SDMBA doing this decommissioning?

SDMBA is not participating in the decommissioning, the Forest Service put this project out to bid for the entire Forest decommissioning and a 3rd party contractor will be doing the decommissioning.

 

Why is SDMBA dumbing down these trails at Anderson Truck Trail?

SDMBA currently has no proposed actions at Anderson Truck Trail. The Forest Service has asked our help in this area as part of our negotiation to keep Anderson Truck Trail open to the public and include it as a formal trail in the future.

 

Why is SDMBA modifying the other trails out at ATT and why have they made changes to it in the past?

SDMBA is not modifying the trails in this area, these are not formal trails and we would do not work on unrecognized trails. SDMBA has never worked on Anderson Truck Trail in a formal capacity.

 

SDMBA should not being doing any work on these trails as they did not build them and have not maintained them…

SDMBA has no interest in taking “ownership” of the trails on this parcel, we are looking for volunteers in the community who know and love these trails. These volunteers can work with SDMBA to utilize our resources (existing volunteer agreement, insurance, tools, gis capabilities etc.) and work directly with the Forest Service to bring the existing alignments into compliance with the District's standards.


There are enough trails for beginner and intermediate riders, build more advanced trails…

SDMBA believes there are not enough trails in the County period. This significant trail deficit can be best filled through a partnership with Cleveland National Forest. Further most trails we build in City, County and local Parks/Preserves must fall within their trail guidelines. In most cases this precludes building purpose built MTB trail and must meet width and multi-use requirements. The Forest Service is our best opportunity to build mountain bike specific trails and gravity/flow oriented trails as these are consistent with management of Forest Service land across the Country. SDMBA currently has 20 miles of purpose built trail on the Forest Service's program of work for 2018 in the Palomar District within Pamo Valley and 5-7 miles of trail with Mt Laguna on the program of work for 2019.

 

  1. Guest Speakers:  Robert Heiar (District Ranger) and Lindsey Steinwachs (Recreation & Lands Officer) Descanso Ranger District (Question & Answer Period)

 

Bob Hiear, District Ranger, Descanso District:  Recreation forward, passionate about recreation management, strong background in building trails.  Formally worked in Albuquerque and Sedona including some downhill MTB specific trails.  Thanks everyone for attending.   Success in working with other IMBA chapters and looks forward to working with the community.  Pleasantly surprised to find that SDMBA, San Diego River Park foundation, County of San Diego and other partners had already been discussing access to ATT.  The public has never had legal access to ATT.  The collaborative had already moved to acquire properties in the area.  The amount of work put into the area makes this process a lot easier to make the decision to turn the road to be decommissioned into a trail.  Balancing the ecological issues and the needs of visitors and the desired use.  Downhill trails do exist on USFS land - Bob worked on such trails in the Sandia Forest in New Mexico.

 

Lindsey Steinwachs: Recreation and Lands Officer, Descanso District. Sees the value in ATT as a trail system and the newer Descanso District staff is progressive and wants to accommodate all styles of riding.  The Region 5 USFS staff including Garrett Villanueva has worked on projects that are purpose built for MTB’s.

 

ATT parcel map

 

El Capitan Reservation access is completely off limits as per tribal policy (World Cup).  San Diego River Park Foundation has acquired some parcels to improve connectivity and the County of San Diego has also been working on acquiring additional private parcels.  ATT is identified in the Alpine Community Trails Plan.  Once legal access is acquired then the FS can work with the community to identify trails including directional MTB only trails.  

 

ATT Road decommissioning Concept  Map: (concept map present to tribes - not a final vision of what is possible in the area for trails to be adopted into the system)  

 

The actual road decommissioning is happening within the next couple of months.  There will be heavy equipment up there.  As road is being decommissioned the crew will be building a single track behind.  One way directional progressive trails mirror the current experience but will be sustainable.  Build trails that will last and be fun.  

SDRPF  and SD County are currently working on easements and acquisitions to gain access.  

 

Question:  Is there really a possibility for MTB only trails?

Bob Hiear:  Open to the idea of MTB only trails with proper signage.  Best to keep hikers off any directional trails for safety.  Downhill directional MTB only trails could be appropriate here with proper signage, etc.

 

Question:  Can some of the trails currently on the ground north of the road to be decommissioned be considered in the final plan? (Finding Neo, etc.)  

Lindsey Steinwachs:  This is a concept map and options can be submitted and considered.  Need to understand the connectivity and the flow of the existing trails to make the best experience.  Need to take a full look at what is on the ground and then consider which existing routes are best to keep with input from the community of trail users.

 

Ben Stone: USFS is our only real choice for making progressive, downhill MTB trails in the county on public lands

 

Mike Jennings: the USFS staff will listen to you. Now is the time to give your input.  We fought for 20 years with no one giving us anything.  The staff here is much more progressive.  Opportunity here to move forward in a very positive direction.  

 

Lindsey Steinwachs: has ridden and/or hiked most all of the trails on the Descanso.  She wants to work with the community so the access and the flow (traffic patterns) works for the best experience for identified trail users. Wants to sit down with those in this room to understand how the area works. Must understand existing use and then accommodate that use in the most sustainable way.  Working on the social aspect of trails and how people move through them.

 

Josh Cassel.: downhill riders need a place to ride without having to worry about other trail users.     

 

Seth Hanson:  suggestion for limited trail access that he observed in WA of putting a large rock at the bottom of the trail to discourage uphill travel by any users.  

 

Don Sutton: Is any trail building going to happen after decommissioning?

Bob:  Until there is legal access there the USFS can’t invest time and money on building or authorizing trails. Can’t just waive a wand a make these trails legal because of the access issue across private property. USFS has an agreement with other partners and is committed to this project.

Encourages SDMBA and members of the MTB community to figure out what we want there.  

 

Ben Stone: The Community that rides the area regularly needs to take ownership of the area and start to gather a concept for what the trail system might look like.   

 

Supervisor Bob Hiear:  El Capitan Tribe not excited that the USFS is working in recreational opportunities near the reservation.  Bob needs input from our MTB community explaining what type of experience is wanted and needed.  Bob understands that if there are not trails that meet the needs, people build their own.  He is trying to explain to the tribe that the community will work together to plan and authorized trail system and that will keep illegal usage to a minimum.  

Bob was invited by the tribe to come see the “damage” done by recreation use on their land. At this time there is no negotiation to be made there.  

 

Kevin Loomis:  SDMBA needs to the downhill community to step up to work with the USFS.  Be part of the process.   

Josh Cassel:  Water bars have been built that have damaged the trails in ATT?  What is SDMBA’s stance.  

Kevin Loomis:  SDMBA does not authorize any work by volunteers on unauthorized trails.  If there is a specific concern please contact offline.  

 

Question: What does USFS mean by sustainable trail?

Bob Hiear:  Sustainability mostly has to do with erosion.  Trail design strategies and best practices have evolved.  IMBA books are better than USFS manuals.  Slope, sticking to the half rule, checking overall grade, armoring of the tread are example of how to make a trail more sustainable.

 

  1. USFS Trail Stewardship Summit Update November 2-5, 2017 (Susie Murphy)

November 2-5.   Check SDMBA.com event calendar.  Registration required by November 1.

 

  1. Review Concept Plan Mt Laguna and note feedback (Ben & Lindsey)

Ben Stone: Progress has been made in this well loved area in working with the USFS.  Proposals for new trail from Pioneer Mail to Penny Pines and to Pine Mountain.  Purpose of the project is protect some sensitive species and meadow area by proposing some new alignments.  This includes new trails and connections, authorizing current social trails like Wooded Hill (MTB specific), and some small reroutes. All of these proposals will have to go through the NEPA process.  Getting the clearance for these sorts of projects sets the stage for years of work.  

 

Lindsey Steinwachs:  A lot of deferred maintenance in the Laguna Area. How can we make these trails better to ride and not to further to degrade the resources?  Improve recreation and protect resources.   The goal is to reduce some the pressures of trail use and spread the usage out.  Huge increase in trail usage.  We can further the ideas of new trails from the entire trails community including trail runners, hikers, etc.  How can the users be managed so that the user experience is better with less trail user conflict.  

 

Question:  How can more downhill community members involved in the process?  

Lindsey Steinwachs: investing a lot of time and energy in volunteers and that is the only way trails will get maintained.  Must commit to volunteer service agreement and get signed on with Lindsey and get up to date on specs.  Mark Constantino and Bill Herold are the current SDMBA liaisons but there can be others that can sign on for significant work to help steward this area.  

 

Bob Hiear:  Where are best opportunities for gravity riding?  Wants to change this and find those opportunities.  Have to balance that usage with all other trail users.  Can’t please everyone on every acre.  Coming tonight and engaging goes a long way to getting the kind of trails you want.  Ultra runners and other groups are coming in and engaging to get what they want.

 

  1. Update on Countywide Projects (Susie Murphy)

Sweetwater Bike Park (Bonita, CA) - in design phase currently.

Black Mountain/Black Widow Trail  - work will start with the rain

Mother Miguel/rock House Reroute - work will start with the rain

New Tool Station installed at La Costa/Denk Mountain

 

Old Business (Non-discussion items)

  1. Tecolote Trails plan - (Evan) - (In progress 2016 build 2017)

  2. Sycamore Goodan Ranch Update (Ben late 2017)

  3. Fanita Ranch Trails Plan (Ben Stone) (Unknown)

  4. Castlerock project date June 2016 grading has begun (One year) Ben

  5. Black Mountain/Black Widow (Matt 2017)

  6. Sweetwater Summit Bike  Park (Jason Showalter)

  7. Del Mar Mesa Surrounding Development

  8. Rock House / San Diego Wildlife Refuge- update (Jose/Jason)

  9. Otay Valley Regional Park - (Jose)

  10. Tijuana River Valley (Jose)

  11. Palm Canyon Update (in Progress October-November)

  12. San Diego County PLDO Funds

  13. Village 13 Projected Date (First Quarter 2017)

  14. Mission Trails Master Plan (Summer 2017)




 

Next meeting: Monday, December 4 6 p.m.  4499 Ruffin road

Note: no November meeting

 

Meeting adjourned:

Minutes recorded by: Susie Murphy


Attendees:

Benjamin Grunbaum

Brandon Aymar

Trevor Reis

Bob Stuart

Bill Herold

Alison Harmon

Doug Johnson

Josh Cassel

Ben Kotnik

Justin Andrews

Jon Green

Jeff Forbes

Jan Charvat

James Perryman

Otto Perryman

Bob Ponting

Steve Hales

Landon Smith

Ray Schumacher

Jesus Colis

Seth Hanson

Jeff Tanzola

Sean Murphy

Mike Jennings

Don Sutton

Morgan Rooney

Scott Armstrong

John Steele

Phil Erdelsky

Chris Dykema

Don Hohimer

Marc Mila de la Roca

Danny Masie

Kirk Bennett

Tom Cook

Jose Galaz

Patrick Geffroy

Dave Forbis

Keven Lee

Kevin Loomis